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Post by bham da jatt on Apr 2, 2005 19:04:56 GMT
sounds like we've come to a conclusion on this thread...
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Post by Desi Tiger on Apr 19, 2005 22:55:39 GMT
i cant understadn it y is every1 jus having ago at each other every forum i go in thers either beef or sumting... i forgot wot i was guna say now....erm.. ..ill rememba nxt time now...but wot conclusion is dat den bro...? ezzy tiger!!!
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Post by bham da jatt on Apr 20, 2005 9:31:54 GMT
lol, khidhaan yaar. conclusion at the mo is: "no we most ppl wouldnt marry out of their race as they understand the consequences r too large in this day n era" c ya bham da jatt
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Post by precious on Apr 20, 2005 11:43:23 GMT
looks like your coming to your own conclusions bham jatt?
I dont think your in any positions to make conclusions about peoples views.
If anything i think this forum has expressed very mixed views on the topic.
To be honest i think sikhi is dying out slowly, there are hardly any religious sikhs in this country, now what basis is that for a religion? culture is more important to people than religion, they talk more about losing culture but how many kids have actually held onto religion and respect its values?
anyway im drifting off the topic now, so laterz
x
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Post by bham da jatt on Apr 20, 2005 12:56:04 GMT
can any1 jus clarify for me something? its very funny isnt it when a person raises up in a Sikh family n chooses to follow no, i repeat NO rule of Sikhi whatsoever, n when it comes to marraige, since somewhere in their raising there was a lack of some sort, they decide to marry out of race n then suddenly out of the blue, when they talk to their parents about it, they say "but Guru Nanak Dev Ji said every1 is equal, so im doing nothing wrong" i can never really understand such ppl, never follow anything in their lives before, n then when marriage gets talked about n they do the embarrassin thing of wanting to marry outside their race, then suddenly they know even Guru Nanak Dev Ji's teachings.... need i say anything else
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Post by precious on Apr 20, 2005 14:26:54 GMT
so what exactly do the youths of today follow? it certainly isnt sikhi hon.
You may be one of the very few siddha saddha munde out there that follows their religion properly, and good on you!
End of the day my point is that sikhs in this country dont even know the meaning of sikhi, so who are they to say what is right or wrong in life.
My second point is that yeah guru nanak did say that everyone is equal, he also disagreed with the caste system, so what religion are you peeps actually following here, sikhism or a made up religion that society has created?
It is for these reasons that i have decided not to follow a religion that doesnt practice what it preaches.
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Post by bham da jatt on Apr 20, 2005 18:12:48 GMT
precious....
right, lets try n conclude this, cuz to be honest i dont find it very interesting to keep on repeating my points. i loved listening to ur views earlier n think i gave good answers to u too, but ur still on the same point.
what do sikh youths follow today, not answering that cuz its not part of the thread!
me being siddha saddha lol, jus cuz some1 follows their religion doesnt make them siddha saddha. any1 else agree with that? fine i dont drink, smoke, all the other backwaas neither, but that doesnt make any1 more simple than the other. it jus shows that i have respect for both culture n religion! again, this is nothing to do with the actual question!
u say ur point is that sikhs these days dont know the meaning of Sikhi, well again, this isnt the question here?!
right...now we have a point, well almost!!
firstly please respect the way u address the Guru Ji's. any1 with wisdom n intellect should b respected, so dont jus casually use Their names in an argument, im sure u can do that much!
right, what HSMANN said in another post is very good n interesting so i suggest u read that. as for caste, well YET AGAIN this is not part of the question, its race hun!
now lets jus clarify, Guru Nanak Dev Ji said that every1 is equal, the Guru did not say that means get married out of caste. this is preciously the reason why all the Gurus Themselves got married within their own caste. this is not because they are being hypocrytes before any1 says that, its simply because they recognise (i hope im right, forgive me if im wrong any1, but its my way of interpreting it) the importance of marrying with your own kind. as this helps u share heritage, culture, religion.
so....the Gurus have not said its fine to marry out of caste, they have simply said treat every1 equally. n neither have the Gurus set an example of marrying out of caste let alone race.
i really do think this answers any questions in terms of what Sikhi believes, anything else i do believe is directly relevant to culture n not religion.
so i think we've answered what Sikhi believes, lets ask each other that within society or culture is this accepted; "Marrying out of RACE?"
please stick to the question, n please i dont think its necessary for ppl to stick religion into this converstation again!
adios amigos!
bham da jatt
x
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Post by precious on Apr 20, 2005 18:41:38 GMT
sikhi, culture same thing!
I cant distinguish between the two anymore cos the religion has been influenced so much by culture its a changed religion.
I also think that religion fits quite nicely into this topic as it is as much religion as it is culture that affects marrying out of race. N afterall this is a punjabi sikh forum so why not bring religion into the topic.
You said yourself that marrying your own kind helps you share heritage and RELIGION so how can you say dont bring religion into this??
N what exactly is your 'own kind'. We are all human u know, I really doubt you marrying a jatti will make your life anymore fullfilling than a person marrying sumone of different race. She could turn out to be a right bit*h who you have nothing in common with. History is history, its in the past, it has no reflection on the character of your future husband or wife.
Its all about LOVE, if you feel you can love an indian more than someone of another race then thats upto you. For me love has no colour, as for culture, it dont exist anymore, we are all westernised now. what culture are you gonna be holding onto exactly, asians today pretend they are so cultural, but when was the last time you saw an indian gal wearing a salwar kameez or a guy wearing refusing to cut his hair or drink. Its a rare thing, culture is lost whether it be religious culture or indian culture, things just aint how they used to be.
Anyways I respect and value your responses, i hope you find yourself a nice jatti that will make you happy.
xx
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Post by bham da jatt on Apr 20, 2005 19:01:39 GMT
precious, u really can be so childish dont mind me saying.
i didnt say religion got nothing to do with it, i said Sikhi does not say u should do it. i answered that question n then said its not about religion now, but its about society!
sikhi culture same thing...uve really lost the plot now. i feel a pecious thats got no leg to stand for.
thanks for the wishes, i hope i do too.
c u later
x
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Post by precious on Apr 20, 2005 19:23:17 GMT
Its society that is ruining the sikh religion. When i said sikhi culture same thing i meant that sikhi has been influenced greatly by society and is more concerned with history and indian values than religious values.
Whats more important being a good person (which sikhi promotes) or being so into your culture that you cant find in your heart to be able to love someone of a diff race?
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Post by Jasi_bham on Apr 20, 2005 23:48:30 GMT
well i wudnt say sikhi has been influenced by society......i think that the followers of sikhi in this day n age have brought society into religion wen there is no need to!!! and about love havin no colour....if only it were that simple...i really wish it was....i wish we lived in an idealistic world where we wudnt b judged n we wudnt judge ovas....but it isnt like that n neva will b no matter how hard we fite!!!
theres def more to a marriage than just love.....love wont ensure ur marriage works....theres so many ova things to consider too!!! n u have to wrk at ur marriage n perhaps jatt is rite....if u both r of the same background ur gonna have a lot more in common n prob a lot less conflicts!!! but love is a good basis for a marriage of course!!!
and ppl will always bring culture n their own political views into religion even tho they shud b left outside the gurudwara....n thats the one criticism i have how ppl do come into a gurudwara n continue to judge ovas....like wen a gora comes into the gurudwara wiv a sikh gal.....ppl instantly judge them!!! n im not countin myself frm it too.....if only ppl cud accept one anova but its neva gonna b that simple....we will always look down at ppl....its human nature....to b truly spiritual we need to lose the ego that we all possess!!!!
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Post by precious on Apr 20, 2005 23:54:16 GMT
yeah but i know many asian marriages that have broken down due to the same problems that gora marriages face ie drinking habits, money problems, in law problems etc.
if anything its all the family interfering with asian marriages that causes break ups. all marriages are prone to failure, its about tolerance and understanding and respect that makes mixed marriages work.
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Post by Jasi_bham on Apr 21, 2005 0:02:02 GMT
lol...well i think ur conviced that a marriage within ur own race wont work!!! sound like a bit of a rebel to me.....firstly i gotta point out that not all asian guys r bad....u mite think they all r backward but they r not!!!! n secondly ne marriage can have probs....but mixed n non mixed marriages CAN wrk.....it depends on the 2 ppl involved we cnt b so quick to generalise
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Post by precious on Apr 21, 2005 0:05:22 GMT
WELL SAID. LETS NOT GENERALISE. I KNOW ENUF ASIAN MARRIAGES THAT HAVE BROKEN UP, BUT THAT DONT MEAN THEY ALL DO.
ANYWAYS BEEN A PLEASURE CHATTIN TO YA JASI, GOIN BED NOW, GNITE
X
N I AINT A REBEL, IM A PEACEMAKER!
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Post by bham da jatt on Apr 21, 2005 8:23:35 GMT
peacemaker? lol. uve dissed 99% of asians on this site precious n u call urself a peace maker?
well i think u 2 girls did well in the end. n jasi thank God u managed to convince precious u cant generalise at all, ur so right in saying that. n thanks precious for agreeing to it!
take care all, may Waheguru bring peace n harmony in all ur lives - Rabh Rakkha
bham da jatt
x
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Post by precious on Apr 21, 2005 9:19:53 GMT
remember bham jatt im asian myself so there is nothing wrong with me pointing out the bad points about our culture.
When i say peacemaker, i mean that i may disagree with the values of some cultures but i am just as capable as loving a fellow indian as someone of as diff race. Basically my overall point is that i think LOVE is more important than culture and tradition. And it IS possible to hold on to both. For me LOVE equals PEACE.
My kids are gonna speak punjabi no matter wot, my boyf is trying to learn punjabi too! Basically my children will know about asian culture as much as they know about their dads. This may seem like a difficult concept for some of you but all it takes is a bit of effort and desire for your children to knw where they have come from. As for religion it will be their choice, but i will expose them to both sikhism and my husbands religion, and their choice if any will be accepted.
Anyways, I aint hating asians, i just disagree with some of their values and i also diasagree with the way sikhism has gone, didnt mean to offend anyone, i know i can get on my high horse a bit.
End of the day I respect everyones views on this forum and never mind people disagreeing with me cos believe it or not i dont think im right i just like to say wot i gotta say.
xxx
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Post by Jasi_bham on Apr 21, 2005 9:45:18 GMT
Well sed precious!!! I think everyone here tends to get on their high horse a bit wen it comes to talkin bout ur own principles.....cos we all think we got the best ones!!!! I think uve got things sorted wiv ur relationship n ur decisions....my aunt did preety much the same thing n her kids have turned out fine....n both have chosen to follow sikhi being exposed to sikhism n christianity....n their dad completely supports that....n they can spk punjabi whereas me a purebred sikh punjabi cant even spk it that well!! neways i wish u all the best n dnt wori i didnt get offended by wot u sed!!! Tc guys
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Post by precious on Apr 21, 2005 9:53:29 GMT
ah thanx jasi, you seem a very down to earth person, that can translate wot people are really tryin to say.
Main thing is that we realise when we have said something wrong and apoligise. You made me realise that i was generalising n i thank you for that. We gotta listen to each other cos no ones right.
N i dont think its right to make comments about peoples upbringing, cos no ones in any position to judge. No ones better than anyone else. We all asian and all from this country, we have all experienced what being an asian in the uk is about, so we should listen and learn from each other.
If anything i have learnt not to generalise asians as they arnt all bad, but ive also learnt that for some asians culture and heritage means EVERYTHING, i persoanlly think love is more important than these things, but i still respect this view if asians.
xx
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Post by SikhLioness on Apr 24, 2005 22:41:18 GMT
Well precious u seem to be a very disturbed and angry person. I can still remember you calling my mum a hoe... how sad. You talk about how bad Sikhism is and how it is dying in this country and yet you say you would still teach your kids sikhism, even though you aint got much regard for it yourself. That darling makes you a hypocrit! UK Sikhs are happily marrying eachother so how exactly is Sikhism dying?
I still can't see what sikh couples are doing so wrong to their own faith. You think a black partner would save Sikhism? Yeh rite, they would make Sikhism even more irrelevant in our society. You clearly need to cut down on what ever you are taking!
I'm glad I aint ever checked a kala, because I might have become an unhappy sado like you. I'm actually quite relieved!
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Post by SikhLioness on Apr 24, 2005 22:47:50 GMT
End of the day I could be as sad as Precious and talk about how black culture aint perfect and how their people is messed up BUT in the end of the day, i aint that pathetic!
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Post by precious on Apr 26, 2005 11:57:14 GMT
Im far from angry in fact im laughing right now at your comments. I havent got anything against sikhism, i think its a great religion but i will only teach my kids real sikhism rather than the fake made up religion you seem top be following. You cant just change a religion to fit in with society which is what many sikhs in this country have done. Just cos sikhs marry sikhs doesnt mean that the religion will last. I mean do you do anything in your life which is in tune with sikhi? Most sikhs in this country go against everything sikhi beleives in. Its real sikhs like bham jatt that I respect, he can still disagree with everything ive said, but he has the right to as he has discipline unlike you fake sikhs. I mean you said earlier that even your mum is ok with you having boyfriends. Theres nothing wrong with being modern, but when it causes a religion to become modernised as well that is where the problem lies. Therefore YES sikhism is dying, and you marrying a sikh aint gonna save it. The only thing sikhs can do to save their religion is practice what they preach and get discipline. Lastly you have already proved that your pathetic by your previous racist comments about black people so lets not go into that again. So therefore no culture is perfect, sikhism definately aint perfect, you marrying a sikh doesnt make it perfect so whats your point again? ??
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Post by fantasy on Apr 27, 2005 10:17:32 GMT
i get wot precious is saying!!!!she is only goin to teach her kids da real ponts bout religion and its not all ot its made up 2b!!!wich is tru cuz alot of asians suppourtind der own culture big it up and say how religous u all are..wen it is tru half of them dont even pry or nutin der down town drinkin clubbin have sex wid any white girl!!
Y ARE PPLE SO ATTRACTED TO DA WESTERNISED LIFE HUH???
and it duznt mata wot religion u are or who u marry is da same religion or not.love is wt it is about at the end of the day!!and i agree da only way it can wrk is if u practice and preeech it...wich not that many pple are doing properly nowdays!!!!!!!!!!!!!thnk u
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Post by DesiBabe on May 21, 2005 14:52:04 GMT
lol i think its pathetic that sadoes like Precious keep posting in here, about the same topic. How is Sikhism dying when there are many proud sikhs out there? It maybe dying in your eyes, but thats just you. Like I said, I have more respect for people who are happily dating and marrying people of their own kind as it is the ideal situation. How fake Sikhs like precious can call other Sikhs fake is soooo funny. Just because many of the people who have posted on here like Sikhlioness and bham da jatt, prefer to date and marry other Sikhs, idiots like you label them racisits and fake! Plus you have criticised Sikhs for having boyfriends and for going out. Look a’~äC»VBjpeople and half casts, they go out every night, and their parents aint got a clue wot they are doing. Thats why theres a high percentage of blacks and half casts in crime. Asians aint as wild as whites and blacks, if they were then this issue wouldn't be so controversial. Sure theres Asians in crime, but all the ones that are work with blacks, which says it all. Another thing, Precious I'm 100% positive Sikhs can marry Sikhs and give them a better upbringing then a mixed one, because all the half casts I know are confused that date whoever, when ever and go out and more importantly HATE their parents!! I thing Precious is being racism as she has slagged off Sikhs dating Sikhs, and has generalised them as being fakes. I still don't see what is so prefect about about other cultures like black. Precious is yet to answer that one. I have already outline some bad ones and I haven't even tried. Anyways, I have many asians friends dating eachother happily and they are all good people who aint confused like fake voodoo preaching Precious. I am dating a Sikh guy and I have no complaints . From what I have read, the only confused people are the ones that ain't happy with their culture and the ones who date their own kind ain't like that.
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Post by DesiBabe on May 21, 2005 14:52:36 GMT
lol i think its pathetic that sadoes like Precious keep posting in here, about the same topic. How is Sikhism dying when there are many proud sikhs out there? It maybe dying in your eyes, but thats just you. Like I said, I have more respect for people who are happily dating and marrying people of their own kind as it is the ideal situation. How fake Sikhs like precious can call other Sikhs fake is soooo funny. Just because many of the people who have posted on here like Sikhlioness and bham da jatt, prefer to date and marry other Sikhs, idiots like you label them racisits and fake! Plus you have criticised Sikhs for having boyfriends and for going out. Look a’~äC»VBjpeople and half casts, they go out every night, and their parents aint got a clue wot they are doing. Thats why theres a high percentage of blacks and half casts in crime. Asians aint as wild as whites and blacks, if they were then this issue wouldn't be so controversial. Sure theres Asians in crime, but all the ones that are work with blacks, which says it all. Another thing, Precious I'm 100% positive Sikhs can marry Sikhs and give them a better upbringing then a mixed one, because all the half casts I know are confused that date whoever, when ever and go out and more importantly HATE their parents!! I thing Precious is being racism as she has slagged off Sikhs dating Sikhs, and has generalised them as being fakes. I still don't see what is so prefect about about other cultures like black. Precious is yet to answer that one. I have already outline some bad ones and I haven't even tried. Anyways, I have many asians friends dating eachother happily and they are all good people who aint confused like fake voodoo preaching Precious. I am dating a Sikh guy and I have no complaints . From what I have read, the only confused people are the ones that ain't happy with their culture and the ones who date their own kind ain't like that.
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Post by fantasy on May 22, 2005 14:00:14 GMT
mixed race commitin crimes...im mixed race half white and half pakistani!!!wot is dat to say? ??ha
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